Quoting rcocean: I think Matt and Bill are far too kind.

Agreed.

Quoting nikkibong: Agreed.

Nikki, Do you want to provide some balance?

Obama should have given the Emperor a back rub.

Andrew Sullivan is in fact nuts. I'm sure he's nice, but he is nuts.

Um, if it's naive to think that symbols mean a lot, then wouldn't that necessarily mean that bowing doesn't mean a lot? Bowing is indeed exactly the kind of symbolic but meaningless thing that Lewis seems to be talking about, but he's acting like it's a big deal! Even more nonsensical opinions from Matt Lewis.

Obama Hakko Ichiu BANZAIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!

That Iowahawk link is so great. No one should ever mention the words 'Sullivan' and 'loads' in the same sentence ever again. I linked to this in another forum but it's worth repeating as an example of the Palin derangement syndrome being suffered by everyone from Newsweek and Bill Maher to MSNBC and some of the commenters here: "The widely read blogger and purveyor of all truth, Andrew Sullivan, was impelled to blog 17 times on the subject of Palin on the same day Americans learned that the Obama administration awarded $6.7 billion in stimulus money to non-existent congressional districts — which did not merit a single mention. To see what is in front of one's nose demands a constant struggle, I guess." Even Megan McCardle is beginning to realize the double-standard is very real: "Y'all well know that I really don't like Sarah Palin. In fact, more than one of you has yelled at me about this. And I find the whole schtick about how the media is just a bunch of elitist hooligans who are out to get her really grating.

That's why I really wish the media wouldn't act like, well, a bunch

I agree. We should all come together, admit she is a hack, and never mention her again.

Quoting harkin: That Iowahawk link is so great. No one should ever mention the words 'Sullivan' and 'loads' in the same sentence ever again.

Yes, because blatant homophobia is rather poor taste. Oh, wait. That's not what you meant?

Quoting harkin: I linked to this in another forum ...

We have noticed. Do you think repeating yourself makes your point more effective? Or does it perhaps suggest ... Sullivan Derangement Syndrome?

Quoting harkin: "The widely read blogger and purveyor of all truth, Andrew Sullivan, was impelled to blog 17 times on the subject of Palin on the same day Americans learned that the Obama administration awarded $6.7 billion in stimulus money to non-existent congressional districts — which did not merit a single mention. To see what is in front of one's nose demands a constant struggle, I guess."

Hmmm. That seems like a small number, compared to, say, how many times your hero, Michelle Malkkkin, blogged about that 12-year-old boy, Graeme Frost, doesn't it? Or, say, Rachel Ray's scarf? Particularly in light of the reality that Sarah Palin is the de facto leader of your party (not counting Boss Limbaugh, of course).

Quoting harkin: Even Megan McCardle ...

Y'know, if you're going to argue by appeal to authority, it helps to appeal to a recognized authority.

No, what's nonsensical is to have an argument about a symbol without addressing the substantive issues underlying the symbolic act. The inside-the Beltway clique never looked more superficial.

Quoting Baltimoron: No, what's nonsensical is to have an argument about a symbol without addressing the substantive issues underlying the symbolic act. The inside-the Beltway clique never looked more superficial.

I have actually blown off the bow as Obama being Obama, but I would be interested in your take on the "issues underlying".

Quoting Freddie: Um, if it's naive to think that symbols mean a lot, then wouldn't that necessarily mean that bowing doesn't mean a lot? Bowing is indeed exactly the kind of symbolic but meaningless thing that Lewis seems to be talking about, but he's acting like it's a big deal! Even more nonsensical opinions from Matt Lewis.

When symbolic gestures show that one is strong, then symbolism is important. When symbolic gestures recognize the strength of someone else, then symbolism is unimportant. This formula in no way symbolizes insecurity.

I blogged about this, but let me emphasize two points I brought up in the post here: 1. There is disagreement about the issue of President Obama's performance. Conservatives argued that Obama bowed incorrectly. There is a countervailing opinion, that he bowed correctly. Indeed, according to one pundit, conservative opinion is racist, because conservatives didn't comment about previous presidents' diplomatic performances with other foreign leaders. I cannot comment authoritatively about the Japanese bow. I do know Koreans bow differently. I bow everyday, but not as frequently as the average South Korean. Yes, it grates on my nerves, but it also improves my relationships. Actually, I have a bigger issue with another cultural habit, and it might provide some insight into this bowing thing. My #1 Korean cultural issue is dinner with bosses and students. I just find having to go out to drink or eat, especially with students, slimy and corrupt. I have done it, though. Many students have paid my tab and I've had some great food and rice wine over the years for free. Still, it annoys me. With my wife's help, though, I've learned how to make excuses why I can't join the dinner much better. I can lie like a Korean can now. The best lie is: I have to attend my family's ancestor

Andrew Sullivan has a clever and provocative mind that offers me more direction for my further analysis than any other blog available. Matt, Bless You, but you bore me. Your take on the day's issues are never more than predictable. Bill, my reading of Andrew Sullivan's curiosity about Palin's birth of Trig is that he indeed began questioning Sarah's maternity. Fair enough, we knew little about the woman....other than that she was clearly a fabulist. Matt, you'd ask Sarah the hardest questions she's ever had???? You haven't got the cunning for your fantasy interview. Not to mention the inclination. You know you'd lose Erik Erikson's LOVE for that offense.......and you don't dare!

As someone who vastly prefers pugs to babies, I have to admit that's a damn cute baby.

The essential difference between Palin birtherism and Obama birtherism is that the latter is a thinly-veiled politically-motivated attempt to delegitimize and possibly even overturn the results of the 2008 election. If Palin had lied about Trig, that would just be another (relatively large) thing to add to the stack of things to count against her. So the analogy is flawed, and Lewis' overblowing it reeks of a Beltway insider getting the vapors over an issue that very few people know or care about. Let's assume that Sullivan is wrong - so what? Is Lewis implying that he should actually abandon his blog and turn his back on journalism, and exile himself from polite society? Hopefully not, so what does his exhortations of "omigawd I'd just be so embarrassed that I would die" mean, besides expressing the horror he would feel if he held viewpoints he thinks are false? Glibly asserting that Palin birtherism (or any sort of birtherism, really) should result in automatic expulsion from the media comes off as pretty vacuous without a meaningful discussion of why some opinions are considered less-tolerable than others. Just because you can draw

Quoting Baltimoron: I blogged about this, but let me emphasize two points I brought up in the post here:

1. There is disagreement about the issue of President Obama's performance. ...

This is argument by proxy, and simplistic at that.

Thanks. Not all conservatives gave it a second thought, however.
I also appreciated the free information. You lead an interesting life.

Quoting ImprecisePsychic: Matt, you'd ask Sarah the hardest questions she's ever had????

In case you haven't noticed, Matt desperately wants to be famous. He expresses this desperation in different ways; one of them is fantasizing about what he would do if he were famous.

I just now got around to listening to this diavlog, and was going to post essentially the same thing. Just because Andrew Sullivan's obsession with Trig's birth and the birthers' obsession with Obama's may be equally crazy or baseless doesn't mean that they're equally important or have the same weight. Birtherism is essentially saying that Obama's presidency is illegitimate; it implicates at least the whole state of Hawaii and possibly the whole American judicial system in a conspiracy. The Trig conspiracy theory just implies that Sarah Palin is a liar who uses her family for political gain. This isn't to excuse Sullivan. I think he's silly. But the better comparison with the Trig theories isn't birtherism, it's the Dreams From My Father-was-written-by-Bill-Ayers theory, which was picked up by the National Review and other legitimate conservative folks (in addition to WND and all the really crazy ones).

Quoting kezboard: But the better comparison with the Trig theories isn't birtherism, it's the Dreams From My Father-was-written-by-Bill-Ayers theory, which was picked up by the National Review and other legitimate conservative folks (in addition to WND and all the really crazy ones).

I think the article I read was in the American Thinker, and by gum, it made sense...have you read that one? As for the Hawaiian birth certificate, I suspect that the problem with not revealing it is that maybe Barack, Sr. and Stanley Dunham are shown not to be married, or some such.

I think the article I read was in the American Thinker, and by gum, it made sense...have you read that one?

The one by that guy Cashill? I think that's the same one that was on WND. It was stupid. Essentially he's saying that Ayers must have written Dreams From My Father because it doesn't sound like a bad poem Obama wrote in college or like a legal paper, because Obama and Ayers use similar tropes/cliches in their books, and because both Obama and Ayers talk about...race. Come on. It's silly, just like the Trig theory is silly. It's completely faith-based. The evidence isn't anywhere near strong enough for anyone who hasn't already decided that Obama or Palin is capable of anything nefarious to believe. But for those who have decided, it's too much fun not to believe.